Forum Topic

Council Pledge to Cut Council Tax Again - Why?

I notice that the council are planning to save each household £27 each per year. This all sounds very noble, but at 50p/week it is not going to make a significant difference to more than a very few households.Wouldn't it be better to keep council tax at the same level and spend the money on services that benefit everyone, including those people to whom 50p/week makes a difference? Our collective £27 contribution can make a far greater impact for the borough than the savings made for each household.I am sure that we can all think of things that the council could do better - here a few from the top of my head: - more police, more of the time - subsidising TfL to keep staff at tube stations like Ravenscourt Park making it safer - keeping the school meal subsidy (I understand that this may be in jeopardy)What can you think of?

Madalyn Roker ● 6480d30 Comments

Since you don't reply, I presume it was a cheap political shot to say that 'Labour wouldn't do it because they are dependent on the unions' - i.e. they wouldn't do it because they rely on the unions for party funding.I only hope that you don't outsource on the basis of which Companies have coincidentally made donations to Tory funds.....

Andrew Broadbent ● 6169d

Are you saying that Labour didn't consider outsourcing because they were dependednt on union funding at a local level ?  Or that they didn't consider it because they were idealogically opposed to it ?

Andrew Broadbent ● 6182d

£27 a year is significant to people particularly those in fixed income. Remember that this would be just one more increment to a long series of rises that have taken place since Council Tax was introduced. The overall tax burden continues to rise significantly especially if you count parking charges which have been a financial boon to the Council and ought to have allowed tax cuts.A period of fiscal constaint is long overdue. All of the things you outline are worth spending money on but first the Council has to look at where money can be saved.

Karen Cooper ● 6201d

Thanks for your reply, sorry for the delay in my response.The statement : "These were previously done by an in house team which the last administration ideologically supported" is a little different from your previous statement (which started me on this, admittedly rather pedantic, line of questioning), that Labour was "dependent on the unions".So are you saying that Labour didn't consider outsourcing because they were dependednt on union funding at a local level ?  Or that they didn't consider it because they were idealogically opposed to it ?There's a big difference, IMHO.

Andrew Broadbent ● 6210d

Only 50p a week. you all sound like insurance salesmen, £27.00 a year will help a lot of people meet the rising costs of their energy bills in our borough, If the standard of social services drop then complain. Please remember folks many other boroughs increased council tax for the year 2007-2008, therefore we could easily be paying 5% + 5% ie; £52,00 per year extra. At the moment everything seems to be running well with the new regime in place, don't knock it!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!enjoy it while it lasts.

Roger Hooper ● 6213d

We can see these 'improvement's the form of dirty streets, second rate waste collection, 200% rise in the cost of meals on wheels, the charge of £12.50 an hour for home help for the vulnerable [previously free], the expense on ridiculous eye sore banners [propaganda] on every lamp post in the borough, the new office building [against residents wishes] on Hammersmith Grove, the new and unnecessary Town Hall, 4x4 spy vehicles, the selling off of our local schools, the reduction of much needed social housing to rent...... 'improvement's' indeed!

John Price ● 6214d

Cllr Bristow when you talk of giving money back to residents perhaps you can spare a thought for Sid the Butcher in Brook Green who thanks to the huge "inflation busting" council rent rises have been forced out of business after decades of personal service and quality products to their loyal customers.Perhaps you would like to let Sid's now ex customers in Brook Green know much the council proposed to increase his rent by so the rest of us can benefit to the tune of a 50p a week reduction in Council tax?

Muj Khan ● 6215d

I have read the whole thread.  I was pointing out that I don't find party political point scoring in any way edifying or enlightening, and I was hoping you would stop.  Thanks.

Sarah Taylor ● 6216d

Please read thw whole thread - I was responding to questions.  The point I made is how the council has achieved savings without affecting services.Through smarter working (e.g. online parking permit renewal) allowing us to reduce our head count, our debt reduction strategy (we inherited an enormous 200 million debt meaning we have to pay tens of millions of interest every year), reducing our reliance on expensive agency staff, and driving down costs and improving standards through competition by tendering service contracts like refuse collection and street cleansing.  These were previously done by an in house team which the last administration ideologically supported.

Cllr Paul Bristow ● 6216d

if you would like to go back to the first post on this thread, you will see that Madalyn asked "I am sure that we can all think of things that the council could do better [with £27 extra per head]- What can you think of?" I can't see where she asked 'Would you like to score some party political points by sniping about party donations".

Sarah Taylor ● 6216d

Have Serco (street cleansing/refuse) or Quadron (grounds mtn)ever contributed to the Conservatives locally?  No - all donations to the Conservatives locally are all easy to see on the Electoral Commission website.Have they given nationally?  I do not nor would ever be in a position to know that info.  You will have to ask Conservative Central Office that question or have the time to go through every item on the Electoral Commission website.

Cllr Paul Bristow ● 6217d

Now that we've got some Councillors reading this forum again, I'll pose this question again.Councillor Bristow suggested that Labour did not cut Council taxes by outsourcing services because they (Labour) were "dependent on the unions".He did not answer my question as to whether any of the companies who stood to benfit from the outsourcing of Council services were (or have been) financial supporters of the Conservative party.Can one of our Councillors confirm that none of the companies have been Tory party donors ?

Andrew Broadbent ● 6217d

I'll try again, as the grammar in my last post was rubbish and I don't want this question to go unanswered :Will Cllr Bristow confirm that none of the companies who might benefit from the outsourcing of Council services have contributed to Tory Party funds, and will not contribute to Tory funds ?

Andrew Broadbent ● 6426d

I would also add that Trade Union members have to 'opt in' to payment of any political levy to fund the Labour Party.I have no chance to 'opt out' of any of the companies who I support as a shareholder or even by buying stuff from them giving some of my money to the Tories.Will the Council categorically state that none of the companies who might benefit from the outsourcing of Council services have not contributed and will not contribute to Tory funds, either locally or nationally ?

Andrew Broadbent ● 6430d

I don't quite understand all this.Who donates to the Tories? is it wealthy individuals that often have their companies registered offshore perhaps.While Trade Unions funds are given by ordinary hard working workers that are residents of this country and city.Are you suggesting that the unions are receiving funds from Libya as Thatcher famously and falsely claimed?

Dan Baldwin ● 6431d

Trade union donations to Labour locally Amicus 17/04/05 £3,000.00GMB 01/03/06 £ 15,000.00GMB 19/04/06 £ 10,000.00 The GMB donations were the largest donation to any constituency Labour Party in the whole of the UK

Cllr Paul Bristow ● 6432d

I notice that you haven't answered my question about how the Labour Council were 'dependent on the unions'.Was it a throw-away remark, or do you have any facts to back it up ?I'd be interested to know.

Andrew Broadbent ● 6433d

MadalynI couldn't agree more. I would even be willing to let them spend my 50p/day it on schools even though I don't have children.  Or how about spending it on sweeping my road every now and again? The cuts to me seem to be more of a publicity stunt than any real benefit to residents.

Sarah Taylor ● 6445d

'residents will see better services as a result of tendering and competition'.After 30 years of privatisation, tendering and competition, could you please give us just ONE example where the British people believe services have got better?Is it not more a case of running down services before you put them out to tender? I would be astonished if anybody could claim that they have not plummeted in the last year.

John Price ● 6445d

Thanks for that, the proof of the pudding will be in the eating, I suppose.Now, can you tell me exactly how Labour were 'dependent on the unions' ?

Andrew Broadbent ● 6446d

I agree that the council have a duty to provide 'decent' services.  I would argue we should be providing excellent services.We are rated as 4 star council for services as well as delivering a council tax cut.  Grounds maintenance and refuse collection/street cleansing are currently going through the tendering/award process.  These will begin next year.

Cllr Paul Bristow ● 6447d

Earlier in this thread you said that "It is the duty of our councils to try to find ways of not spending so much of our money, not the reverse."  Surely your 'duty' is to provide decent services, not just to save money ?Maybe you can tell us which services you propose to outsource so that we can keep an eye on the service improvements that you expect ?Oh, and how exactly were Labour 'dependent on the unions' ?

Andrew Broadbent ● 6447d

I am confident that residents will see better services as a result of tendering and competition. This will see exciting bids from the council in house team and other contractors. Almost every other council in London has gone through this  Labour would not do this in H&F as they were dependent on the unions.It is not council money - it is taxpayers money.  We have a duty to spend wisely.It is possible for lower taxes and better services.

Cllr Paul Bristow ● 6447d

"For too long the myth that tax cuts = service cuts has been allowed to linger."And for too long, the myth that all anyone wants is lower taxes has been perpetuated by the 2 main parties and the people who make least use of council services.  Those supporting the cuts better hope that they or their relatives don't need to make use of some of the services which have been cut, or they'll be laughing on the other side of their faces.I'm happy to pay a reasonable rate of tax to get decent services and I know I'm not alone in that.Anyway, how am I going to decide what to spend my 50p a week on ?  Decisions, decisions....

Andrew Broadbent ● 6448d

50p a week? Come off it who exactly are you trying to fool? certainly not all the elderly residents that used to use the town hall canteen as a social centre. Could you neo-cons please tell us what alternative arrangements have been made for these elderly people that have worked all their lives and lived in this borough.24hour policing? what you have done is divert the police from certain areas to others. Not increased their numbers.Thanks to the London Mayor you are being stopped from massively reducing the number of rented social housing. A Shirley Porter attempt at gerrymandering on your behalf.A 35 million pound reduction in services by privatising local council run services giving local people employment to outside companies.Waste on 4X4'S at a time when you neo-cons are pretending to go green. What is your policy on reducing co2 omissions please? Your leader could certainly set a good example by getting on a bicycle, heaven knows he needs it at this time when obesity levels are soaring amongst our kids.Turfing out blind residents to make way for new plush offices for yourselves and closing down schools.Certainly sounds like you are looking after your own interests not the residents. NU TORIES? SOUNDS LIKE SAME GREEDY OLD TORIES TO US.

John Price ● 6450d

For too long the myth that tax cuts = service cuts has been allowed to linger.Are we to believe that there is no room in the councis for savings? Do we all want to see huge rises in council tax as inevitable as Summer following Spring as has happenned under Labour administrations?We have made savings through reducing our reliance on agency staff, getting rid of political advisors, more efficient ways of delivering services (such as online parking permit renewal) and through tendering services.We have also invested in 24/7 policing in crime hotspots (the only place in the UK) and in our parks and green spaces.It is only right however, that we give money back to residents through council tax cuts when we can.Let us imagine that we had continued with Labour inflation busting council tax increases (87% in London since 1997) rather than two consecutive cuts.  We would all paying hundreds of pounds more a year in council tax.  It is the duty of our councils to try to find ways of not spending so much of our money, not the reverse.

Cllr Paul Bristow ● 6453d

I am sure that the recipients of meals on wheels that now have to pay 100% extra to eat are over the moon.

John Price ● 6453d

I take it that you are being flippant rather than deliberately missing the points which Madalyn is making ?  - that 50p a week is neither here nor there to anyone, irrespective of income ?- that such a trivial reduction could be better spent on maintaing existing services rather than cutting them further ?So, what will you be doing with your 50p a week, then ?

Andrew Broadbent ● 6474d

Dear Madalyn, or can I just call you Mad?I am glad that you are sufficiently well-off not to appreciate a second consecutive reduction in H&F's council tax. To many people, any reduction in their living costs is very welcome. When taken on top of the last reduction, and if the council manages to continue this trend, H&F residents will benefit from significant savings, while residents in other boroughs experience huge annual rises.If you do not want your council tax to be reduced, I assume you will be making additional voluntary contributions.

Edward Noel ● 6475d

Madalyn - I agree, lower tax doesn't necessarily mean happier voters.  Maybe they can re-instate some of the healthcare services which I understand were cut earlier in the year.IMHO they should also levy some kind of tax on the companies who distribute the free papers which now clutter every bus / tube / station / street in the area........

Andrew Broadbent ● 6476d